Probing Pensions questions answered

From Gene, Nov. 16th: Tim, Excellent work on the massive cost of Providence disability pensions . You mentioned during your report that, unlike judges in the past, Providence firefighters contributed to their pensions. If memory serves me, when this scandal first broke years ago, I remember reading that those who qualified for a "disability" pension had all their own contributions to the pension system returned to them-with interest, in a lump-sum payment! During that '90-92 time frame, fully 88% of Providence police officers and firemen retiring did so with a "disability" pension, which was 6 times the national average.

Tim White: Gene, you are correct. Providence firefighters (and at one time police officers) were allowed to get a one-time check for their contributions to the pension system when they were granted an accidental disability pension. This practice for firefighters ended just this year.

We explore this a little further in Part IV, which is airing Thursday at 11 p.m. But you’re also correct on the number of firefighters that retired on disability, 8 out of 10 back then. That has since calmed, by our count 1 out of 5 are out on accidental disability now.

From Bob, Nov. 6th: How is it that retired state troopers who are already collecting a pretty sweet state pension can work for the state again, or a city or town in the state retirement system and then retire from that with a second state pension? No other state worker is allowed to do that. I'm sure the law allows troopers and only troopers to do it but if others can only collect one, what makes them so special? A state pension is a state pension, no?

Tim White: You’re right, Bob. State troopers are the only state workers exempt from the state’s double-dipping statute. They are allowed to collect a pension and a paycheck from the state at the same time; as long as it’s not in the capacity as a trooper.

The reason behind this: troopers are the only state workers who have a mandatory retirement age. It used to be 25 years of service or at age 55. Recently that was changed to be after 30 years of service (they added language that troopers cannot be any older than 34 when they are hired).

One of the corner-stones to not allowing workers to double-dip , is the practice encourages people to leave their job. With troopers, the state is forcing them to leave, so some view it isn’t fair to apply the statute to them.

Viewer Comment: School budgets are being cutback affecting education and other services. Why do us taxpayers who are finding it hard to make ends meet always end up suffering for this crap!! I hope you keep on this. What can we as taxpayers do to stop this!!

Tim White: Thank you for the post. Your frustration is a big part of why we decided to do this series on pensions. There has been a lot of discussion by politicians, both on a municipal level and the state, to change the system. Several proposals have been bandied about, from the extreme: going to a defined contribution plan (i.e. a 401k style plan) on the state level, to Mayor David Cicilline’s proposal of merging all municipal pensions with the state (as many communities have done), to make one unified retirement system.

You will hear more about the poor state of the pension system every time the market tanks ; taxpayer contributions to the state pension system more than doubled between 2002 and 2008 – up to $350 million in ’08. Frank Karpinski, who runs the state retirement system, says much of that is due to Wall Street’s nasty couple of years. But he also says “the perfect storm” – baby boomers retiring and retirees living longer – is creating a drain.

There is a commission, chaired by State Rep. Timothy Williamson (D- West Warwick) on the state level to take a look at how to change the pension system. Keep an eye on how this plays out. I cover these meetings from time to time – and you can also track them on the General Assembly website .

Viewer Comment: I am a wife of a retired policeman who served 24 years on a police department in Rhode Island. He served with honor, dignity and good work ethics. Unlike many of his "buddies" who I watched "get hurt on the duty" with so called knee, back or fabricated injuires. They served an average of a couple of years and have been sitting pretty with a tax-free pension that they did not deserve. Thank you for investigation and hope that they catch up with these undeserving people and do something to right a wrong.

Tim White: Thank you for the post, and to your husband for his 24 years of service. You have a very interesting perspective on this story. I can tell you I speak with a lot of people in law enforcement; from state, to federal and city. There is a common theme of frustration from men and women who are still on-the-job about fellow officers, who they feel, are taking advantage of the system.

You never know how people will react when you do a piece like this. I have generally had a positive reaction from people in the law enforcement